Welcome to another Marvel Handbook, I’m Jim Trabold.
I’m back finallyl; my old computer went down. My hardrive crashed. Sorry for the wait. I’ve got tons to cover. Sorry Daron for being late.
Late? That’s a bit of an understatement don’t you think?
Let’s start though.
Do you even listen to me?
Jay emails
Great article as always, you guys are really on the ball and it is always an enjoyable read. Just a few quick questions:
Thanks Jay. We do our best.
1. Do you have any info or insight into the upcoming “Civil War” storyline? I’ve done some looking around and haven’t found much about it.
What I can tell you that I know without to many spoilers:
It will center around the Government trying to force superheroes to register as a result of the events of House of M and Avengers Disassembled – a move which some heroes are for whilst others are against. This will result in the two sides starting a Civil War.
New Avengers: The Illuminati is one of the main books coming out of this. But this story has been building.
The Illuminati: are a group of superheroes who joined forces and secretly work behind the scenes in the Marvel Universe. The group was formed after the Kree-Skrull War. Though they were around a long time beforehand, they first appeared in New Avengers #7
The members include Professor X, Doctor Strange, Mister Fantastic, Namor, Iron Man, and Black Bolt.
Some of the major books that have already been impacted:
Secret War
New Avengers
Incredible Hulk (lead in to Planet Hulk)
From Marvel: Get ready because the Marvel Universe is gearing up for a CIVIL WAR! Two years worth of big events at the House of Ideas (Avengers: Disassembled, House of M, Decimation, Enemy of the State and others) have sent ripples through the Mighty Marvel Mythos. Watch those ripples rise into a tidal wave of tension as Civil War leaves no corner of the Marvel Universe unaffected. The road to Civil War begins in March with the New Avengers: Illuminati one-shot where the Marvel brain-trust revealed in New Avengers is ripped apart. And when the greatest minds of the Marvel Universe can’t agree, it can only mean one thing: WAR! The first shot is fired in May as the 7-issue Civil War mini-series kicks off a mega-event by the all-star team of Ultimates 2 writer Mark Millar and New Avengers penciler Steve McNiven. When half of the Marvel Universe takes on the other half and it’s brother versus brother, you will have to decide: Whose side are you on?
One event confirmed to be happening during Civil War is the upcoming wedding of Storm and the Black Panther. Joe Quesada said “the actual wedding will be one of the most unusual and memorable weddings ever because of the time and place it occurs.”
2. The one item I did find was a comment about the whole new Iron Spidey Suit and how Spidey may owe Tony a debt because of this and may have to choose a side when the Civil War comes. Speaking of the suit what did you guys think of the new suit? It looks interesting, but I wish they would just go back to the black suit, that was the best suit.
The new suit actually starts in the current Spidey storyline and comes out of that. You know this THE OTHER thing.
As for the suit itself I don’t really like it. The colors are all wrong and it just doesn’t look all that great. Not to say it won’t get drawn better in the books but it’s just not fitting of Spidey. I’m betting it will last through Civil War if that far and goes out to the pasture afterwards.
3. Why does Daron despise Gambit? LOL
Daron care to answer?
You know I’ve actually explained this here in the handbook before quite thoroughly, but honestly since we’re 3 weeks late and this one is pretty long, let’s just say he’s one of those characters that I just don’t like. I’m sure you don’t like every character, and some of those dislikes maybe completely irrational. Suffice it to say I have a completely irrational dislike for the character and everything about him.
4. I think you explained this before but I couldn’t find it in the archives, but what was the whole Wolverine losing his admanitum (sp?) and his bones being used as the claws about? Didn’t Mags have something to do with this?
Magneto ripped Wolverine’s adamantium out of him. It was back in Fatal Attractions. Logan also had to deal with a lot afterwards. He started becoming more feral and also had some of the bone claws broke.
He got his adamantium back thanks to Apocalypse. Apocalypse made him a Horseman and gave it back in the process. But Logan went close to 3 years or more before getting it back. Some interesting stories if you check your shops back issue bins you might find the issues of Wolverine
Thanks, have a great day and Daron rules all. LOL
LOL Welcome
*Spits out coffee* HAHAHAHA.
Thanks bud, you just made my day.
Ryan emails
Hi Jim,
Hey Ryan
Love the article. I might remove Petra and Darwin from the list of powered mutants after M-Day. I have a feeling that neither one of them is around anymore to use their powers. My theory is that they were part of an original “New X-Men” team sent to Krakoa before Giant Size X-Men #1 and they died. To cover it up, Xavier mind-wiped everybody. The guy in Deadly Genesis that’s kicking everyone’s butt is another member of that fateful team who has somehow managed to come back to life. Just a theory. What do you think?
Interesting take on it. I have another take myself. You might be right on the mutants listed in the back up story. BUT I think I know who the Third Summers brother is too.
Recall that Krakoa was sent into space at the end of Giant-Size # 1. The scene that starts the book is space. So the character we’re seeing it Krakoa. It let Cyclops go way back then. Now it’s only after Cyclops and looks like Thunderbird I. Ok here’s my idea. Professor X big secret is that Krakoa is the mutated form of the Third Summers brother. I did ponder this and someone came in the shop with the same idea adding a new theory in. I think it makes the most sense.
The mutants in the back up story could still be the first team sent there so your theory could be right too.
*Comes back from getting more coffee*
So what did I miss?
MebertPrime posted
Hola!
Thanks for the answer on my last question. Here is a doozy though.
Hey Merbert. Your welcome
I’m a huge Spiderman fan and missed out on a lot of Spidey during my 90’s comic book hiatus. I’ve heard good and bad but still am unsure of the events known as “The CLone Saga” and “Maximum Clonage” and something about the Symbiote planet??? Can you help me out here with your vast wisdom?
Sure I can. I’m a big Spidey fan to and even though I wasn’t big clone saga fan either I still read it.
Not to bash Merbert, because I know not everyone has read every issue of the handbook, but I’m really curious how many times we’ve covered the clone sage here. I’m willing to bet that it’s almost once a month. Got any numbers for that Jim?
Specifically, what happened with the people who showed up around ASM # 375 claiming to be Peter’s parents.
Let’s start with Pete’s parents. The true story: Chameleon with the help of the second Green Goblin Harry Osborn created robots that looked like Peter Parker’s parents. It would lead to Spidey facing Chamelion and taking him down. Of course it was Harry’s last revenge.
How the clone saga came about
As for the clone saga. It about not to long after the fake parents story. We see that a person has been following Pete and the like for some time. The figure it Ben Reilly the Spider-Clone/Scarlet Spider. In a story called Power And Responsibility he made himself finally shown. Of course his story started before that
Web Of Spiderman #114 – The first we see of him is while he is speaking on the phone with Aunt May. She makes a reference to the fact that they’ve chatted before.
Spider-Man #48 – He phones May’s home again, but unbeknownst to him Aunt May is currently recovering in hospital from a heart attack she had in ASM #391. It’s Mary Jane who picks up the phone and the stranger obviously recognizes her voice.
Web of Spider-Man #115 – Our mystery man phones the Parker residence again and MJ tells him to call Forest Hills Hospital if he wants May. He storms out of the cabin and heads towards his motor-cycle.
Spider-Man #49 – He’s collected his pay from work and is heading back to New York. We get a good look at his ring – it’s from graduating Midtown High.
Spectacular Spider-Man #215 – While en route to New York, we catch a glimpse of our mystery man saving a kid from being flattened by an oncoming truck.
Web of Spider-Man #116 – He shows up at Forest Hills Hospital but makes a sharp exit when Peter appears.
Amazing Spider-Man #393 – We see him at the start of the issue, laying a rose on Gwen Stacy’s grave. Later, he visits Midtown High. In a conversation he has with a passing cop it is revealed that our mysterious stranger used to attend this school also.
Spider-Man #50 – Now he’s snooping around May’s house in the middle of the night, but makes a break for it as soon as Spidey appears.
Spectacular Spider-Man #216 – Our mystery man is sitting with Aunt May at the hospital. He sees Spidey swinging past the window, so he makes a hasty exit. He goes up to the roof, where the two of them come face to face. And what do you know – the mystery man looks just like Peter!
So that’s how it started. Of course it ran through the Spidey title from 94-96. His final story: Revelations. We find out that the person who brought back the clone is none other then Norman Osborn who is not dead. So hope that helps.
what kind of craziness went on with Venom and the symbiotes after Venom took off to be in the Lethal Protector and Funeral Pyre limited series.
Alright this one should be interesting.
We’ll go with Venom series by series after Funeral Pyre
Venom: The Madness: Venom faces the rage of Juggernaut, Dusk, Paranoia, and Necromancer
Venom: The Enemy Within: Venom faces Morbius and Demogoblin
Venom: The Mace: He faces a new character named Mace
Venom: Nights Of Vengeance: He teams with Vengeance to face the The Stalkers (Briggs, Raiden, Kass, Trent)
Venom: Separation Anxiety: The 5 symbiotes come back and separate Venom from Brock
Venom: Carnage Unleashed: Venom vs. Carnage.
Venom: Sinner Takes All: Venom vs. the Jury, Sineater, Dreadnaughts, Tarantula II as the wife of Brock also gains the suit for a time
Venom Annual #1995: We finally see where the symbiotes come from in a series of annuals in Spider-Man titles in 95
Venom: Along Came A Spider: Scarlet Spider now as Spider-Man fights Venom and Hybrid shows up as well
Venom: The Hunted:Venom is hunted by close to everyone that can show up in one limited series.
Venom: The Hunger: I never understood this one myself.
Venom: Tooth & Claw: Wolverine vs. Venom
Venom: On Trial: Venom is on trial with DD and Spidey involved
Venom: License To Kill: Venom goes to kill a man called Doctor Yes
Venom: Sign of the Boss: Venom vs. Ghost Rider and Teraknid
Venom: Finale: Venom vs. Spidey as the symbiote supposedly dies.
The symbiote or should I say a Venom symbiote would come back in a new Venom series.
Thanks tons and hope I can keep you busy!
Welcome. Yes it did.
Colin emails
Good day, I have some issues,
Best fighters: This debate the last few weeks has left me with a bad taste in my mouth. I can’t weigh in on who THE best are, like Taskmaster and such, but I’ve seen heresy in that Punisher has been consistently placed above Daredevil. Daredevil is one of the marquee fighters in MU, and Ennis had Punisher say, in his own book, that he’s never been a match for hornhead, and has to use dirty tricks to get by him. Daredevil is a better fighter than Punisher. Period.
Hey I never said DD wasn’t a better fighter then Frank. I don’t think either really made my list. But I would say DD is a better fighter then Frank. Frank is better with weapons.
I don’t recall ever seeing Punisher on our lists either, unless it was from a reader, but even then I’m pretty sure I would have called them on it”¦
As for Thor, Daron’s wrong. Strength does not mean that you have no fighting skills. Yes, he often just uses his brute strength, because why not? But he’s been a warrior in Asgard for centuries, where opponents are more to his strength level, so he’s honed his fighting. And if I remember my Marvel cards correctly, he was always a Level 7 (Maximum) in speed, so Superman can’t hold that over him. Thor would whip Mr. Kent. As good as he is, and I think Supes could take a few rounds on Thor, I honestly believe the only reason Superman could really beat Thor is because he’s Superman, and might as well be Jesus, as far as comic characters go. DC editorial would never let his defeat happen, unless it’s Batman.
Well this Thor/Superman thing might go on forever fight wise. I’m not even really saying Thor would win the fight although he might just because the magic factor. But I just don’t think Supes is worthy to lift the hammer. But that’s another debate.
I never said having strength means you don’t have fighting skills. I said that characters with superhuman strength shouldn’t be qualified in the discussion we were having. Similarly I stated that I don’t think Thor, Hercules or many other characters who rely heavily on their strength would last long against most of the trained fighters on the lists. That’s not to say they wouldn’t put up a fight, I just think someone who has been trained specifically how to observe and control a fight and an opponent is going to defeat someone who’s main battle experience has been to use his brute strength to defeat an opponent.
As for the Thor/Superman thing, I’m not going to comment on the worthy subject since Jim brought it up and not Colin, but I do disagree with the speed factor. I’ve never seen Thor move anywhere near Superman speed before, and I’m pretty sure Jim stated the same fact a few weeks back when this debate was raging. Supes has often given the Flash a “run” for his money. I honestly think this is a pretty even match, but the one advantage Supes has is his speed.
And Gambit vs. Nightwing. Of course Nightwing would win, but it would be a good fight. Remember, Remy’s beat Wolverine before. He’s no slouch, Daron’s personal bias aside
peace .
Remy isn’t a slouch as a fighter as you said, Just that Dick is one of the best fighters known. He learned everything from Batman. I think without his powers Remy gets his ass kicked
Also I think Remy only beat Logan because of Luck.
Agreed. And just because he can beat Wolvie doesn’t mean jack against Dick. Amazingly, Jim and I agree on this one. Dick is gonna win this one hands down, even if Retard uses his powers. And I’m not just saying that because of my previously stated irrational hatred for the character (as I think I stated in this original argument). Dick is just a far superior fighter, period.
TherCanBeOnly1 emails
Greetings again. Don’t worry, I’m not writing about an Iron Man/X-Men fight. I do have an Iron Man question/observation/complaint tho. In the Extremis arc going on right now, the bad guy beat the shit out of Iron Man, forcing Tony to go under the process himself. In my arguments during the whole X-men fight debate, I’d been assuming that over the years Tony had been actually improving the armor. It would follow a certain logic, don’t you think? For this guy Mallen to have beaten him so badly, either Iron Man isn’t as powerful as he once was, or Mallen jumped way up into the top tier of powerful bad guys all at once.
Maybe the writer just has to do some research or this guy gained some new powers himself. You know a power upgrade. Very much like what many writers do with the characters to make them a bigger threat. Remember Iron Man only really has one ultimate foe. The Mandarin is his most powerful threat. Mandarin’s son isn’t a slouch either though.
Not saying Iron Man’s foes are lame but they need some better upgrades to stay with Shellhead.
Are there any company or industry wide awards for comics? You know, best penciller, best writer, etc.?
Company wide I don’t think they have them BUT industry awards are common.
Hell fan awards are as well. Let’s go through some:
Our site itself has had votes from our staff on best of everything from each year.
Both have fan awards. Most of the time they also have online ballots.
Then there’s industry awards like:
Harvey Awards
Eisner Awards
National Cartoonists Society Awards
Ignatz Awards
Along the same lines, what would be your favorite comic book movie of all time? And also, the worst?
Hmmmm alright I’ll rank them:
1. Sin City (I know not Marvel but I think it’s the best)
2. Fantastic Four
3. X-2: X-Men United
4. Spider-Man 2
5. Punisher (2004)
6. X-Men
7. Spider-Man
8. Blade Trinity
9. Hulk (without the last 30 minutes)
10. Elektra
11. Blade II
12. Daredevil
13. Men In Black II
14. Men In Black
15. Blade
16. Generation X
17. Punisher 1990
18. Doctor Strange
19. Captain America
20. Nick Fury Agent of Shield.
21. Man-Thing
22. Howard The Duck
WOW, I have to say I’m really surprised at your list, Jim. FF was far from the 2nd best comic movie of all time (though it was good”¦just not THAT good), and blade trinity was easily the worst of the trilogy.
Here’s the way I’d list them
Top 5 (starting with the best and only including movies I’ve seen)
1. Batman Begins (a truly amazing film)
2. X2
3. Spider Man 2
4. Superman I
5. Road to Perdition
Worst 5 (Starting with the worst and getting only slightly better)
1. Sin City (a truly awful movie that’s been over hyped to hell)
2. The Hulk
3. Generation X
4. Punisher 1990
5. Blade Trinity
I’m sure I’m going to catch some flack (especially about Sin City), but eh”¦that’s just the way it is.
Here’s something I’d like to throw out to the female readers (uh, if there is such a thing). Superman has xray vision. He’s a guy. Would you be comfortable around him knowing he could see you naked at any time? See, if I lived in Metropolis I’d go into business making lead lined underwear, and my advertising would depict Superman as a big perv.
Alright female reader email in or post a response for this.
And then you’ll have to figure out how you’re company is going to pay for all the lawsuits it gets tangled in from all the women who come down with cases of lead poisoning from your lead panties”¦
As far as your list of fighters goes, I don’t see why Cap would be down on the list. Who really has beaten him in a fair one on one fight, where nothing storyline was going on, like the super soldier formula wearing off? Sue Storm beat Iron Fist hand to hand in an early issue of the new FF series.
I did say Cap was the best. Well hero wise. Taskmaster might be 1. Maybe 1 and 1A.
Yes I agree Sue is strong. Likely lucky to beat Iron Fist though. She was allowed to use her powers. But I think Sue is up there in fighters. Don’t worry I’m going to try to solve this debate somehow.
I’m not saying Cap isn’t a good fighter, I just don’t think he’s as good as some of these guys who have devoted their entire lives to the art of fighting like Shang Chi or Iron Fist. Yes Cap is strong, he can fight and is a great tactician, but that doesn’t mean he’s the greatest fighter.
Ok, that’s it for now. Thanks for taking my questions. You guys do good, necessary work.
Welcome and email again
Les emails
Dear Jim,
Wow. I have to agree with Daron on this whole “fighter” thing. Guys like Thor and Hercules shouldn’t count into this. While they do have eons of fighting experience ( Thor anyway ), they are still not the most skilled fighters in the world. Of course I’d pick Thor in a fight over most people, but that’s because he’s nigh unstopable, not because he can do a backflip into a spin kick.
Thor is trained as a fighter. Let’s say he can’t use his powers I still think he would kick most peoples asses. I know super strength wise it might explain why but still Thor has to be one of the best. Herc too.
Well Jim aside, I’m glad someone sees my point. Thanks Les. There is a difference between brawling and trained martial ability to observe, control and defeat opponents.
I’d also go so far as to say that Taskmaster should hold a special place of honor as a “permanent number one” due to his ability to “steal” other fighting skills. So here’s my list.
1. Captain America
2. Shang – Chi
3. Iron Fist
4. Wolverine
5. Karnak
6. Black Panther
7. Elektra
8. Deadpool
9. Daredevil
10. Nick Fury
Cap at number one? Hell yes. Cap is the ultimate fighting machine, regardless of Shang Chi and Iron Fist. He’s in top physical condition (actually better then best human athlete ) and he’s learned almost every fighting style on the planet. His “never say die” attitude and indomitable will also help him greatly.
Yep Cap is # 1. Agreeing to that here. I don’t care what Daron thinks. I also agree Taskmaster might just be permanent number one with his skills. That list is likely the most accurate one so far. Might have Cable on it though. Remember he is a great fighter without powers.
Though this is a better list, I think I’d put DD over Deadpool, and I’d like to see where it says Cap has learned every fighting style on the planet. This could be true, but I’ve NEVER heard this before. I know Bats has been rumored to know just about all of them, but I’ve never seen this mentioned about Cap before. Please someone enlighten me. My beliefs about Cap are thus. He’s military trained, has almost superhuman strength, and as Les said an indomitable will, which is how I truly think he wins most battles. Plus as I stated he’s a brilliant tactician. All these things though don’t make him the best fighter. Again if it’s been stated that he’s been trained in every martial art, I might change my mind, but I’d like to see a little proof.
I actually feel Iron Fist and Shang Chi are tied for second. But Iron Fist has been crapped on in the last 10 years … so I’d put my money on Shang Chi always winning the fight due to the regular fans hatered/disinterest in Iron Fist. The rest go without saying … and yes, the Punisher doesn’t make the list due to sucking in a fight once you disarm him.
Hmmmmmm Well I admit that the last few Iron Fist series have really hurt the character. I don’t think the fans hate him though. But those two are equals. Also I did notice no Echo to. I would think she’s up there. Also I think Spidey and Deadpool are higher then Daredevil
What? Spidey is not a better fighter than DD. He’s got superhuman strength, but he doesn’t have any formal training”¦ Why is DD getting crapped on all over the place here. All he has is his fighting skills, yet everyone is treatig him like a blind redheaded step son :)
Oh… and I firmly believe Moon Knight or Night Thrasher come in at number 11.
Let the debate rage on!
wolfbaronxylo posted
Can you tell me what happens with Wolverine and Mariko, from the point after Hirohito sends out their wedding invitation?
Happily ever after right?
Mariko though is dead. Let’s explain how it happened back in Uncanny X-Men.
As the wedding approached, the X-Men’s long-time foe Mastermind used his psionic powers to compel Mariko to call off the wedding and strengthen Clan Yashida’s criminal ties. After Mastermind’s defeat Mariko felt deep shame at the actions she had performed under his control. She vowed to break her Clan’s criminal connections, feeling that she could not marry Wolverine until she did so.
To that end, Mariko became a force in the Japanese criminal underworld, using her influence to help the former X-Men of X-Factor in a clash with the criminal cyborgs of the Cybersamurai. However, her authority was subsequently challenged by both by Matsu’o Tsurayaba, leader of the ninja clan the Hand, and by her own half-brother the Silver Samurai. Wolverine and his allies fought the Hand on her behalf but when Mariko sought to make peace, Tsurayaba had her poisoned.
Wishing to avoid prolonged suffering, she asked Wolverine to grant her a quick death, which he reluctantly did. The Silver Samurai subsequently ascended to the leadership of the Clan, while Wolverine vowed to make Tsurayaba suffer for causing Mariko’s death.
Mariko was buried on the grounds of her family’s ancestral home, to which Wolverine makes a pilgrimage every year to honor her memory.
Knightmare emails
Hey Jim and Dark Overlord (Why is it DOL? Why not DO? Overlord isn’t hyphenated or two words. F$@&# English major. He probably thinks Shakespeare wrote all of his own stuff–we all know it was 100 monkeys and a typewriter, and one of those was Fabian Nicieza.),
Hey Knightmare you’ll have to ask Daron why it’s DOL.
Because DOL looked better on the helmet and DO did”¦That and I think that’s what Danny first called me when he gave me the nickname.
On Superman/Thor–I’m not a DC Apologist or a Marvel Advocate. I’m a middle-of-the-road comic geek. And it’s a fact that I strongly dislike Superman and would put two Kryptonite hollowpoints in the back of head if I got the chance to write at DC. So with that in mind I’d like to put this debate to rest. Superman can and should be able to juggle the Uru simply because he’s WORTHY. You don’t have to like him, but the fact that billions of people around the world do pretty much gives him the right to wield it. Suseptibility to magic doesn’t matter. WORTHINESS matters. He’s an Icon. Icons can lift the damn hammer. Batman should be a ble to as well. Maybe even Hal Jordan. Booster Gold? No. Lobo? Nope. Green Arrow? Not likely, he’s fairly famous but not an Icon. Think of it like this, if you walked into the tribal village of the Dogon people in Africa, and asked, “Click-click-tock-Who besides Thor should be able to lift his hammer-click-click?” the likely responses would be, “Who’s Thor?”, Superman, Batman, Spider-Man. They’re icons. By the inscription Odin wrote on the hammer, they’d be greenlit for use.
Science and magic and brand loyalty has nothing to do with it. Neither does character versions, much as I hate to agree with the Dark Overlord, but it wouldn’t matter which continuity or Elseowrlds you pluck him from, Superman can use the hammer. I remember an issue of Captain America where Steve the 80-Year Old Virgin was sitting in a malt shop with Thor and was worried about the amount of hero-worship he was getting at the time. And Thor said, “We Asgardians occasionally wonder, ‘If people ceased to believe in us, in the Gods, would we still exist?’ Barkeep, another of these frothy malted beverages, anon!” I think more people ponder Superman than Thor, and I think that says it all.
Hmmmmmmmm Maybe. You might have just given a solid reason Superman can lift the hammer. But the magic factor should stop those factors. I think I’m correct on that theory. The hammer is magic. Superman is weak against magic so in essence he can’t lift it.
Jim, I think you just read what you want to read. Knightmare explained the magic thing above, and it basically states the same thing I’ve said in the past. The hammer having magic properties in no way would stop Supes from hefting it. Do I really have to explain the difference between a susceptibility to magic and a weakness again?
On Marvel Fighters–
I think this discussion needs to be looked at from a lowest common denominator point of view. Take away superstrength, claws, healing factors, mutant or cosmic abilities or other augmentations. And then try to figure out where they’d rank. Here’s my Top 10 but I’m just loosely ranking them in Top 5 and Next 5 (I’m at work, and trying to do this between fielding calls from IDIOTS. People, it’s the 21st Century and if you don’t know what a “mouse” is, or what “right-click” means, or what a “cursor” is, not only should you not
be employed in any job with even a slight association with technology but you should probably just be taken out back and shot. Hail Hydra!)
The Top 5
Black Panther
Shang Chi
Iron Fist
Electra
Logan
I think you’d have to have Shang Chi, Iron Fist and Black Panther as the top three, with Logan and Batroc rounding out the top five. Electra (ignore the movie, if you would please, thanks), Shang and Danny are trained martial artists, T’Challa is as well plus he’s
had to survive in the jungles of Wakanda. Logan is probably the best undisicplined fighter the MU has, even without any of his abilities or Weapon X augmentations.
Well hell I’ll agree with this just because Cap isn’t at the top :)
The Next 5
Zaran the Weapons Master
Captain America
Batroc (I know ridiculously high for a Frenchman but for my argument he’s gotta be there)
Frank Castle
Luke Cage
I never understood why Zaran is perceived as a third-tier disposable badguy. He’d go toe-to-toe with Shang Chi back in the Moench-Gulacy days but in Electra (I want to say Jim Balent was drawing it but I might be wrong) she took him out in ONE panel! Cap got
the experience in WWII but I don’t know, if you take away his shield, that he’s going to be able to hang with the rest of these folks. Frank was Spec. Ops. right? They can throw down. Batroc is French, so he almost doesn’t make the list on that point alone. But Savate is a legit martial arts style, and he’s the only character–Marvel, real life or otherwise–I can recall using it so I put him in on the novelty factor. Luke gets in as my street-cred ghetto brawler, yo. Word and foshizzle.
Now, I fully expect some to take exception. Some notables who didn’t make my list and why:
Daredevil–if I take away his powers–meaning his radar–he’s blind. And while blind people can and do acheive high ranks in martial arts in the real world, I doubt that they’d be considered Top 10 figthers. It’s an unfortunate handicap, but there it is.
My rant earlier aside, I’d agree with this, though it was never stated before that he wouldn’t have his radar”¦
Taskmaster–my homeboy–doesn’t make the cut because his abilities are derived from photographic reflexes–an ability I’ve seen some bios describe as “mutant”. Does that mean he was affected by “M”/Decimation? Without the powers, what is he as a fighter? Beats me. Karnak, Thor, Herc, Drax–no cosmic crutches allowed. Fury, Deadpool, Cable–they’re right near Frank Castle I suppose, but Frank’s SpecOps training and his constantly evolving combat methods in his war on crime I think give him an edge. Deadpool, Cable and Fury rely a lot on guns and gadgets, Frank’s had to infiltrate places with just a “Rambo” knife and know-how.
It does hurt though for me to not put Taskmaster at the top of the list. For me he represents one of the three cardinal points on the Mighty Marvel Coolness Spectrum:
Taskmaster<----->Spider-Man<----->Gambit
HA!
In all truthiness (thank you Stephen Colbert!) Taskmaster is the greatest character in the MU. He’s the coolest, he’s got a great costume–the classic, not the Udon Studios’ “We’ve secretly replaced TM’s wardobe with stuff we picked up from Snake-eye’s garage sale, let’s watch…” crap. He can kick anyone’s ass if a writer with a pair of cajones would put him in that scenario. He’s so cool he edges out Von Doom on the Spectrum, by a nonbot’s breadth mind you. Spider-Man is the central coolness factor. He’s in my opinion the quintessential Marvel Icon. He’s their Superman. Wolvie might sell more issues, but Pete’s more recognized world-wide. And what’s not to like about Pete? Danger Sense, super-strength, sticks to walls, scientific genius or close to, loving Aunt, large-breasted redheaded wife? He’s got it made in the shade with lemonade. And then there’s Gambit. Ever wonder what would happen if someone took that stupid metal bo-stick of his, shined it up real nice, turned it sideways and stuck it up his ass? If you got it up there far enough, it oughta start glowing a lovely pink and then BOOM! It’s like the men’s room at the mall when Sbarro’s has a two slices for the price of one special. THAT’s how uncool that guy is. And he’s quasi-French for Pete’s sake. AND now you tell me that in one version of X-Continuity he’s a F#$&@! CLONE!!??!! What sorta nefarious act of douchebaggery is that? Memorandum to all comic creators who frequent this site, and aspiring writers as well: No Clones. EVER. Between Spider-Man and George Lucas, you’d think you’d learn.
Wow that was a rant and a half there.
*Rolls around on the floor, laughing uncontrollably.*
Let’s go threw this a tab. I will say it’s not a bad reasoning all over for everything you said. BUT why is Cap in the middle. Cap is the peek athlete. He always has been and beaten mostly everyone you listed. So he should be higher on the list. I think he’s Marvels best fighter. He can beat anyone. Well almost anyone in a fight. So my argument will always be Cap should be highest even without the shield.
Being the best athlete has absolutely NOTHING to do with being the best fighter. If you take a world renown triathlon winner, and lock him in a cage with even a subpar fighter like Steven Segal, do you really think the triathlon is going to win? Now imagine putting him in that same cage as Bruce Lee”¦please. If that’s the best argument that can be made for Cap then my case should be made already”¦
The rest you said. Well I can’t and won’t argue. I think everyone agrees now. Taskmaster is cool as hell and should be in more comics. Hell in reality Ronin should have been Taskmaster.
AS for the casting bit, that was about the only thing Wizard did that I enjoyed. The lasting pages. I didn’t agree with them all the time but they were fun. I’m as big a fan of wrestling as I am comics, so I completely understand where the reader is coming from with the HHH suggestion. However I’d recommend Sven Wollter, who played King Hrothgar in the 13th Warrior. Trips is better in a roll where he can display his comedic talents. I thought he was pretty funny in Blade 3, as bad as that one was.
Also HHH might be a better bad guy. He’s always been better as a heel. He just pulls it off so well.
Well, I’ve been writing this intermittenly for 3.5 hours, so I suppose that’s enough, eh? By the way, I hear Daron”¦ *edited for content* And because I can. HAHAHAHA!
Well you ranted a good amount so I’d say you where up doing this long enough. Write us again. You really made a lot of sense and good arguments.
Tase emails
Here’s a question for you:
As a big Agent X fan, I’m glad to see Outlaw as one of the 198. We can count Alex Hayden as a “magic” origin character, so he wasn’t affected by HoM. Most likely Mary Zero lost her powers and is now able to be seen by people other than Alex Hayden.
That leaves one person: Taskmaster. For decades his powers have been labeled as natural. But then the Taskmaster miniseries started to hint that his powers were mutant in nature.
So do you think us Taskmaster fans should be worried about our favorite Skull Mask in the Decimation hero? Would you consider him a natural or mutant hero/villain? (And us, I was the one that asked a few months ago if Deadpool was mutant or science)
Taskmaster isn’t a mutant supposedly. But if he is I’m betting they keep him around. I don’t see them getting rid of his powers. He’s to cool to get rid of. So don’t worry my friend. Taskmaster should be safe.
Deadpool is powered so I also assume Agent X is too so those should be safe too. Incase you wanted to ask
Oh and Taskmaster is a villain but would’ve so made a better Ronin
That’s it from my end. Daron care to sign off first?
Sure thing. It’s good to be back. Keep those emails coming everyone, and see you in a week.
Alright my turn. I had two weeks of hell. Sorry I was late. I’ll be updating everything next week. Sorry everyone for being late again.
That’s it from my end. Reporting from my corner of the Marvel Universe I’m Jim Trabold. Have a great week and see you at the comic shop.
